How can I tell?

Sw Anandgyan wrote (July 12, 2003):
I've picked up another Mass in B Minor,( if they're not a budget reissue, sometimes they're second-hand ) and while I was duly impressed with Harry Christophers and The Sixteen, the third recording of BWV 232 by Michel Cordoz and his Ensemble Vocal de Lausanne has me perplexed.

Is this a HIP one or not ? My ears are not well-trained, I think I've only been listening to those period-instruments to one exception, Richter, and can hardly differentiate between those two "schools".

I find the flow so "bumpy". It's a peculiar interpretation. I don't regret its purchase for it allows me to contrast it to the scintillating cohesiveness of the likes of Brüggen and Herreweghe.

Bradley Lehman wrote (July 12, 2003):
[To S.W. Anandgyan] Why does it matter if something can be labeled "HIP"? There are many different degrees and attitudes in being Historically Informed, and about how it should affect Performance. Performances are not black-and-white "HIP" or "non-HIP". There are not exactly two "schools" of performance here.

Or were you merely asking about the pedigrees of the instruments in Corboz' performance, the hardware?

Sw Anandgyan wrote (July 12, 2003):
... Sorry, the conductor's name is Michel Corboz, but you knew that didn't you?

The 'Authentic Instruments' or 'On Period Instruments' is not always mentionned on the covers and my question was about a particularity in the sound. I have read something about the bow but don't know exactly what is the difference.

Still in the early stages of my Baroque grooming.

Thanks again

Thierry van Bastelaer wrote (Jul;y 13, 2003):
[To S.W. Anandgyan] Corboz uses modern instruments in most of his recordings (exceptions are, I think, his second Monteverdi Vespers, and the "other Vivaldi Gloria"). Both his B Minor recordings use modern instruments, and yet in a sense his performances are informed by historical practices (small forces, controlled use of vibrato, use of mezza di voce, rather brisk tempos,...). I remember that when his recording of the Christmas Oratorio was released, it was received as a good equilibrium between the "old" practice and what was at the time a still rough early instruments approach. In my view this recording remains a very worthy alternative to the more HIP recordings, in large part because of the presence of Equiliuz and Watkinson, and the fervor that characterizes most of Corboz' recordings of religious music.

Sw Anandgyan wrote (July 13, 2003):
[To Bradley Lehman] Thank you Mr. Lehman

Yes I was asking mainly about the "hardware". I need to read it in the liner notes and not all practitioners bother to mention it. Philippe Herreweghe is known to "use" period-instruments though this is not often blatantly written as I'm listening to his recording of the Missa BWV 233.

I will listen to the '65 recording of the same oeuvre from Kurt Redel and will sense again a different feel. May I correctly assume from the decade of its appearance that this is a modern-instruments one?

The Corboz rendition of the BWV 232 is a late Nineties recording and I cannot tell if it's on period-instruments or not. Granted it is not merely the " tools " used but an approach.

I admit my question borders on how to differentiate draft beer from bottled ones, or radial tires from regular ones and ultimately is irrelevant to one's enjoyment of the music.

It's for my personal awareness that I'd like to know in which camp should I consider the Corboz recording on the label Aria Music belonging to and keep on learning.

Thanks again for your reply.

Johan van Veen wrote (July 13, 2003):
Thierry van Bastelaer wrote:
< Corboz uses modern instruments in most of his recordings (exceptions are, I think, his second Monteverdi Vespers, and the "other Vivaldi Gloria"). >
There are others as well: Cavalli's Ercole amante and Charpentier's David et Jonathas are the recordings which spring to my mind. Both are quite good but have some weaknesses, in particular in regard to the singers.

Francine Renee Hall wrote (July 15, 2003):
Like Brad, I feel labels can be misleading and confining. If something isn't HIP it's considered garbage and not worth anyone's time or money. It's as if light is the only part of the electromagnetic spectrum that counts simply because we see it. But there's a whole range of spectrum out there, including x-rays, infrared rays, ulttraviolet, etc.

I'm sure would have welcomed changes from his score to include adult singers and modern instruments. But this is not the point. The point is to have a *choice*. Without choices we are boxing ourselves in, not wanting to consider exploring and evolving.

Harnoncourt once said that music is alive, not dead and dusty museum pieces. And he has gone the gamut from pioneering HIP to combining HIP with both original and modern instruments.

I am just pleased to know that I have an entire range of choices to make and to wonder at their unique interpretations.

Bradley Lehman wrote (July 15, 2003):
[To Francine Renee Hall] Francine, as always, makes good sense. But she'd better watch out for the Purity Policy for the Promotion of Virtue and the Suppression of Vice, or whatever they're called.

Bach Mass in b/Corboz

A. Brain wrote (December 27, 2003):
The original Corboz recording from the early '70s is a favorite. It once appeared on MHS and also RCA Victrola LPs.

I finally got this on an Erato CD, and the timings indicate that it is about 124 minutes. Maybe this is a mistake, as I had thought back then that this was a fairly brisk performance.

Then, flipping through an old copy of ARG, where Suzuki's recording of the Magnificat got a rave review, which I marked for future reference, I noticed a review of another Corboz recording, date unspecified, but the ARG issue is 11/12/99. The review is maddeningly ambivalent ( no suggestion like, buy, skip, get such-and-such instead?), but is generally favorable, noting that at 102 minutes, this has to be one of the fastest on record. Even Gardiner is not that brisk.

Aria 970901 (Qualiton)

Naturally, I want to find this, but so far no luck. I guess Qualiton is more difficult to deal with now that they are no longer associated with Eastern European bureaucracies.

Anyone heard this or have it.

Simon Roberts wrote (January 1, 2004):
In article <JQcHb.491$EC7.330777654@newssvr30.news.prodigy.com>, A. Brain says... [snip] < Anyone heard this or have it >
Had it, but no longer have it - too fast for the performers to do anything with aside from sound fast (it sounds a bit as though he's trying to be HIP-influenced but has learned little more than that HIP=light and fast). The orchestra is dominated (when they're playing, that is) by the trumpets, which make an exciting racket but do so with little discrimination and, thus, are ultimately not exciting at all. A couple of the soloists are good, and the choir is serviceable, but I don't think this is seriously competitive with the best recordings, HIP or otherwise.

Michel Corboz: Short Biography | Ensemble Vocal de Lausanne | Orchestre de Chambre de Lausanne | Recordings of Vocal Works | BWV 232 - M. Corboz